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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I haven't seen this posted on here at all, so I thought I would let every one know something I found out last winter. For all of you that have ethanol in your gas, you should be worried if you let your quads/bikes/small engines sit too long. I stopped in a sled shop last winter to get some carbides for my CAT, and was BSing with the guys about anything and everything. They were a small shop, and they had 17 sleds in there I think all with blown engines. They said that it was due to the ethanol seperating from the gas (I guess kind of like how was does if there is air in there and you let them sit for a while). I realize that it is now winter, and I am sure some people aren't riding their quads quite as much, which a lot of people don't ride their sleds in the summer time (unless you ride across lakes like me :)). Anyway, they said that when you run straight ethanol after the gas is used up, that it is like running straight NOS into your engine. I am not up to par that much really and all the workings of engines (I am a NUKE), but I know enough what that means. So they were advertising this stuff, and for the life of me I can't remember, but tomorro when I go race, I will look in my trailer and post again what its called, but it is suppose to either eat up the ethanol (like stabil does to water I think) or recombine it back with the gas. I just thought I would give you all a heads up if you are from a place that uses ethanol like the Northeast. The guy said they were having the same problem with boats as well. I haven't looked at my quad enough to know if there is a simple drain on it (like there are on the bottom of carbs) to drain any out, but I put this stuff in all the time like its a religion. Hope this helps anyone, and if anyone has any questions, I am sure one of the fine people on here that have more of an idea of what it could do can explain it to you.

It is called Startron, and STABIL has a version as well. It is a Enzyme fuel treatment. http://mystarbrite.com/startron/content/view/93/123/lang,en/
 

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I use Sea Foam in every single tank all year long. Ethanol fuel is also Hygroscopic just like brake fluid. In a vented fuel system, if the fuel isn't used up, water collects and will also do damage to the engine.
 

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there is two gas stations that sell ethanol free gas in my town. that is what i use. i can get ethanol free 93 oct. hopefully the gas stations will keep getting ethanol free gas around here. i havent used any gas treatment yet in my 700xx. i like the seafoam though. i use it in my boat.
 

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I haven't seen this posted on here at all, so I thought I would let every one know something I found out last winter. For all of you that have ethanol in your gas, you should be worried if you let your quads/bikes/small engines sit too long. I stopped in a sled shop last winter to get some carbides for my CAT, and was BSing with the guys about anything and everything. They were a small shop, and they had 17 sleds in there I think all with blown engines. They said that it was due to the ethanol seperating from the gas (I guess kind of like how was does if there is air in there and you let them sit for a while). I realize that it is now winter, and I am sure some people aren't riding their quads quite as much, which a lot of people don't ride their sleds in the summer time (unless you ride across lakes like me :)). Anyway, they said that when you run straight ethanol after the gas is used up, that it is like running straight NOS into your engine. I am not up to par that much really and all the workings of engines (I am a NUKE), but I know enough what that means. So they were advertising this stuff, and for the life of me I can't remember, but tomorro when I go race, I will look in my trailer and post again what its called, but it is suppose to either eat up the ethanol (like stabil does to water I think) or recombine it back with the gas. I just thought I would give you all a heads up if you are from a place that uses ethanol like the Northeast. The guy said they were having the same problem with boats as well. I haven't looked at my quad enough to know if there is a simple drain on it (like there are on the bottom of carbs) to drain any out, but I put this stuff in all the time like its a religion. Hope this helps anyone, and if anyone has any questions, I am sure one of the fine people on here that have more of an idea of what it could do can explain it to you.

It is called Startron, and STABIL has a version as well. It is a Enzyme fuel treatment. http://mystarbrite.com/startron/content/view/93/123/lang,en/
Who ever who told you that is full of sh1t, There are many side effects that ethanol can cause but that is not one.

Ethanol can eat up old rubber fuel lines (pre 93), weaken some older cheap metal tanks etc. and also damage some older injectors as well. All of today's engines and fuel systems are 100% ethanol compatible

Ethanol will not seperate from gas, It will collect moisture in an unsealed fuel system though.

There are too many myths and truths to but in one thread but the guy who told you this is totally uneducated on methanol.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Sorry Smo0oth, but it is what I heard. And they had tons of sleds in there with blown engines, so apparently if they didn't know what they were talking about, then there is another cause for all the blown engines. As I said, I am no expert on the matter, I was just relaying what I heard, and that wasn't the only place I heard it from. I realize that a lot of today's engines are compatible with Ethanol, otherwise they wouldn't be using it everywhere, but an excessive amount of it I would think could cause damage. Isn't that why they are limited to a certain percentage at the pump? I will have to look it up to see if ethanol will seperate, but if it does, then they could be right.
 

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Ethanol is the opposite of nitrous, it is less volitile than gas also. There is allot of confusion about ethanol, that guy is definately adding to it.
 

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heres what happend to me. i have a suzuki eiger 4x4. let it sit a long time. would not start.took it to the shop. inside the carb was green-looked like mold.had to rebuild the carb. ethanol is alcahol, it draws mosture. must use feul add.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Alrighty, so I feel a little dumb. As I said, this was over a year ago when I went to this shop. I called them up, and they said the problem was with mainly two stroke engines, b/c of how ethanol draws moisture, which is what you all were saying. Ethanol is less volatile as stated above, and the problems they were having was that the moisture/ethanol mixture that seperates from the gas (ethanol will seperate from gasoline when it is combined w/ a certain percentage of moisture) will compete with the oil mixed with the gas, therefore the engine wont have enough lubricant, which we know what will happen in that case.
I then asked about the whole NOS thing, as I remember that part, obviously, and he said the only thing he could think of that someone at the shop could of mentioned NOS last year was that they were doing some work to a sled and installed a NOS kit. So now I feel really dumb, as I was getting 2 different things mixed up. He did say though that the enzyme treatment has helped out drastically with the people around them using it. Something about them sending samples in for tests and whatnot.
So, I am sorry for the misguided post above, but it was a year since I heard it, and thought maybe it would help someone out, and that some others would enlighten the rest of us.
 

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No problem, I've posted information before from hear say and have been corrected. I learned to double check research before making post.
 

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NOS or nitrousoxide is a non flamable gas! straight the engine would not run. no fuel for combustion
 

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In vehicle racing, nitrous oxide (often referred to as just "nitrous" or as NOS after the name of the brand Nitrous Oxide Systems) allows the engine to burn more fuel and air, resulting in a more powerful combustion. The gas itself is not flammable, but it delivers more oxygen than atmospheric air by breaking down at elevated temperatures.
Nitrous oxide is stored as a compressed liquid; the evaporation and expansion of liquid nitrous oxide in the intake manifold causes a large drop in intake charge temperature, resulting in a denser charge, further allowing more air/fuel mixture to enter the cylinder. Nitrous oxide is sometimes injected into (or prior to) the intake manifold, whereas other systems directly inject right before the cylinder (direct port injection) to increase power.
The technique was used during World War II by Luftwaffe aircraft with the GM-1 system to boost the power output of aircraft engines. Originally meant to provide the Luftwaffe standard aircraft with superior high-altitude performance, technological considerations limited its use to extremely high altitudes. Accordingly, it was only used by specialized planes like high-altitude reconnaissance aircraft, high-speed bombers, and high-altitude interceptor aircraft.
One of the major problems of using nitrous oxide in a reciprocating engine is that it can produce enough power to damage or destroy the engine. Very large power increases are possible, and if the mechanical structure of the engine is not properly reinforced, the engine may be severely damaged or destroyed during this kind of operation. It is very important with nitrous oxide augmentation of internal combustion engines to maintain proper operating temperatures and fuel levels to prevent "preignition", or "detonation" (sometimes referred to as "knocking" or "pinging"). Most problems that are associated with nitrous do not come from mechanical failure due to the power increases. Since nitrous allows a much denser charge into the cylinder it dramatically increases cylinder pressures. The increased pressure results in heat, and heat will cause many problems from melting the piston, valves or warping the head/cracking or predetonation.
 

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STA BIL has their version of the gas/ethanol treatment out now. We have had a lot of problems where I live with this especially two stroke jet skis. I treat everything that sits for any amount of time. Its cheaper than carb rebuilds.
 

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I do petroleum work ( tanks, pumps, lines, dispensers ect.. ) Its not the ethanol that really damages stuff, more humidity/water than anything. Granted, ethanol is some bad stuff as we have encountered ( eats up some meters in gilbarco/wayne/tokhiem equipment, eats seals that are not viton, eats up older rubber lines, also will break free rust, muck and grime up inside of old tanks and lines. ) But the main problem with ethanol is that it mixes with water. The process is called phase seperation, which basically the water will suspend at multiple levels in the gas unlike straight gas where the water sits at the bottom and can be drained/pumped out. We have dealt with alot of this stuff and it is a pain.

The ethanol itsself is pretty much straight corn liqour + an added amount of chemical to prevent you from drinking it ( cant remember the name of it ) It burns better than gas but nets a much MUCH lower mpg.
 
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