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I think it is the tread pattern that helps the push. The tractor analogy might not exactly fit here. They are looking more at surface area, minimizing compaction like Baxter said. I have had the front end push on many a 2WD tractor, but not ever that I recall on a front wheel assist(with or without the front end kicked in). There again, you can argue that it is the pattern over the size. The open differential is also a important difference.
 

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the reason why tractors turn so tight is specific to their application. they need to turn tight to get in and out of the tight spots they live in. backhoe tractors turn even tighter as they are used in cramped construction areas. they also move very slow, if our wheelers would have the same turning ratio, it would be easy to loose control at speed. the new can am atvs have two settings to their power steering systems to make ppl more comfortable with the ease of steering at speed.

last thing honda wants is more lawsuits...they learned their lesson with the trikes.
 

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You guys have a lot of interesting ways to look at things...

I'm ready to put the tractor analogy out to pasture, so to speak...I was digging a bit on the concept of tall tire vs short on the front/rear. For the sake of discussion, lets assume front and back are the same foot print (compaction) and turning radius has not been altered...Lets assume the xx and IRS, but very tall on front vs very short.

Does tire height make a difference, or if it does, is it so slight that it doesn't really come into play? There have been comments about it in different forums especially 22 vs 23. Can 1/2" radius make a noticeable change? I supect lowering the CoG on the front helps turning. I am trying to get my arms around how going up in height would help turning. Not to say it doesn't, just trying to understand.

Has anyone made a large diameter change (couple of inches) to only front or back on the same machine and can comment on the experience?
 

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i really dont know why but when i put 23' ams black widows 4ply on my recon they replaced the stock 20'' good years that were on it.... i lost about 9'' on my turning radius.... same with my osportsman 700 i put 2'' bigger fronts and lost a few inches...
Hey Maniac, did you lose the turn radius because the front was slipping more? It almost had to be didn't it? And then of course, the question: Slipping more because of the tire/tread, or because of the height.
 

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Being a farmer, it depends on what kind of tractor as to where all the weight is. Anyway, not only do tractors have differentials (if 4x4 they even have 2), but they have brakes for each side. When someone plows their field, or your BackHoe guy is getting in a tight spot, they lock up say the left rear tire to turn left,and vice versa. They have bigger tires on the back more so for traction, that way if they get into some deep, and considering the differential is the lowest part on any tractor in the rear, bigger tires allow more ground clearance. Now some tractors have huge tires in the front as well, but those tractors articulate in the middle to steer, so your everyday tractor wouldn't be able to turn w/ big tires in the front considering they steer just like our quads. Also, the amount of degrees that you can turn the average tractor tire (side to side) I bet is probably another 15-20% more than it is on the XX. Just my 2 cents (and I grew up/ live on a farm).
 

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Wider front a-arms is the solution for the low speed turning issue.
Are you suggesting a benefit of different turning radius, or less understeer/push?
 

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Yes. [both]
The key to stopping the front end push when turning comes down to 2 things.
1 = change your tyres for better ones .
2 = suspension. there are simple things to help out on the bad suspension and there are expensive ways.
It all depends on what you ride (terrain) and how you ride (weekend warrior -Racer)
 

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Longer a-arms have greater turning leverage over the rear tires.

Honest answer. :D
Hate to say this but :tdown:. The way to do it by changing camber and castor of the front spindle .
I'd love to find someone with a totally stock 700xx and prove it !
This is what all aftermarket front a-arms do.
Width has bugger all to do with it !
 

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Hate to say this but :tdown:. The way to do it by changing camber and castor of the front spindle .
I'd love to find someone with a totally stock 700xx and prove it !
This is what all aftermarket front a-arms do.
Width has bugger all to do with it !
I bet if you left the camber/caster stock and had after market (wider) a-arms it would turn better.

I would love to get a sponsor who would let me do a test...



 

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Longer a-arms have greater turning leverage over the rear tires.

Honest answer. :D
OK, so you are saying less understeer/push, yeah? But does the geometry change with the wider arms? If not, then it falls into the same category as shocks, tire pressure/height/side roll, sway bar...if it is geometry change then it is in the caster/chamber/toe and turning radius group...
 

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Hate to say this but :tdown:. The way to do it by changing camber and castor of the front spindle .
I'd love to find someone with a totally stock 700xx and prove it !
This is what all aftermarket front a-arms do.
Width has bugger all to do with it !
Does your longer a-arms allow the steering radius to be more than stock Baxter? I have to look at it, but I understand there are some limiting factors with the stock set-up...
 
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