dobeck settings? - Club700XX - Honda TRX700XX Forum
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post #1 of 5 Old 03-26-2010, 09:48 PM Thread Starter
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dobeck settings?

What are you running and what are your settings?

Are the FMF, EHS, HMF, etc programmers exactly the same and just relable?
I have an FMF on the way.

Also any suggestions on my settings for my FMF programmer, an FMF 4.1 slipon and UNI filter? Eventually will be adding the Powerbomb and maybe the EHS lid but need settings for just the slip on and filter for now.
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post #2 of 5 Old 03-27-2010, 07:41 AM
 
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NOOOOOOO they are not the same, they may look alike but they are totally different


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post #3 of 5 Old 03-27-2010, 03:20 PM
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I am running the HMF Exhaust with their controller. I went on their website and they show you what to program it at for what power you want / style of riding you are doing. I would suggest seeing if FMF has any recommended settings for their exhaust.
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post #4 of 5 Old 03-27-2010, 11:41 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EHSRACING View Post
NOOOOOOO they are not the same, they may look alike but they are totally different
Is it their programming that's different? I believed they all basically do the same thing which was control fuel flow.
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post #5 of 5 Old 04-01-2010, 10:34 AM
 
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Yes the programming is different, they all control fuel flow that includes anything and everything pc3, pcv, hmf, fmf, ehs, dynatek, yada, yada. The pc3 and pcv work the same the pcv has more "resolution" yet the both require a map to be loaded in and a lot of tuner intervention to be maximized for performance. They do work very well when setup correctly but when they are not they may not work worth a poop or fair at best its all up to the person putting the map in it.

And trust me for atv's those maps on the DJ website are usually off in left field when people bring me there bikes to tune, at least out to second. The street bike maps are usually generally pretty close but atv's nope it generally takes me between 45 mins and 90 mins to generate a well working map with a 50k dyno setup and some pretty extensive tuning experience. PC3/PCV work off alpha-n which is tps/rpm basically you tell the tuner to either add or subtract fuel at a whole mess off positions. For a pc3 something redlining at 8500rpm you would have about 270 values to modify more yet for the pcv. You have a grid that you have to set the value for each position then when you modify the map you can choose what to modify and what not to.

I would say most people generally just load a map that someone else told them was good as goes along there merry way never knowing there is generally a bunch more power to be tapped from tuning it. And in my opinion really defeats the whole premise behind the pc3/pcv. The down falls with the pc3 are when put in the hands of someone without much experience usually does more harm than good. They are fairly easy to get to work ok but to really do what they are capable of I donít see any other way than a dyno. They donít really distinguish between gear ratio or load for example say your bogging your bike in 3rd gear and mash the throttle to 80-100% its going to modify the fuel parameters based on the value you set for 80% at say 4000rpm sooo your value there says adds 20 points of fuel then 18 for 4250 then 18 for 4500 or what ever all bike are dramatically different. Ok no big deal but now you do the same thing but not lug at quite such a low rpm its going to travel through those rpm ranges quite a bit different maybe still not such a big deal but defiantly a factor a lot of tuners donít consider. Now through in a different gear ratio go up or down and do the same scenario its going to act quite a bit different. What im saying is load plays a very important role in overall performance for fuel delivery. With the general tuning with alpha-n it makes it sometimes difficult or very difficult to create a map that itís to is potential for all scenarios. The pcv has a lot of cool options thatís its capable of that im sure 99% of the world will never notice or see that can do some pretty cool things to address those things and a lot more its really a pretty cool complex little bugger. But it does require some add-ons and a lot of knowledge/ time.

For the dynatek or relabeled dynatek fuel controllers (not ignition) I have yet to have one of them in my possession that I thought worked well. I will admit that I donít have extensive experience with these units but more than enough to gather info to form an opinion. As far as I can tell at least the ones I have used all tune on a rpm only based variables which takes what above I said about load and magnifies the issues but about 100 times. There is no way in my opinion that someone can create a happy map with rpm being the only factor on handing from delivery channel to delivery channel or there low-mid-high it just doesnít work well at all. It may keep it from running lean but for a performance side of things they donít get the job done at all. Again im not talking about the ignition controllers they do work very well.

For the Dobeck or relabeled Dobeck (like ours) these are much more popular hence a lot of companies picked them up and started using them because it was a very easy way to get into the fuel injection market and offer a product. The thing I have found although easy a lot of companies didnít really take the time to figure them out and really find what it takes to create a map that works well. Which is the main reason there is a lot of criticism floating around the net that people couldnít make them work and they are a pc3 fan for there 3 mod bikes. I have had more than a couple here that I have tried to tune for customers that were just plan programmed awful and I couldnít believe that it was product with there name on it. Now some people think they can take a tuner that was designed for one scenario and put it on something dramatically different and expect it to work this is not true these tuners are designed for a certain scenario well at least they are supposed to be I donít know what scenario some of them I have scene were designed for at all it definitely isnít what they were supposed to be for.

These boxes donít use alpha-n tps/rpm which if you ask some people is a downfall I donít see it that way at all, the use a calculated factor of tps which is load. This really allows one to handle some of the load scenarios I mentioned above and for the rest I will generalize how I design base maps because im not sure how some of the other guys do it and I think is what really separates are boxes from the other look alikes. First every bike is different and each has its own things it likes and doesnít a map for a kfx 450r does not work on a yfz450r or ltr 450r or etc etc. This is not just in reference to fuel quantity of course each one will need different amounts of fuel but how the fuel is delivered is the important aspect.

The timing and load factors are key to how well a tuner can work and not work. This is what we spend a lot of time figure out what works and what doesnít work. When you figure it out I then account for what people will do in the future and try to compensate adjustments to a certain point so they donít need to reflash or get a new tuner because they put a higher lift cam in. The key is to have enough parameters in the box to compensate or deviate from the base map to allow for a range of adjustments but not so much that itís so vague nobody can fine tune it in and your left with either to much fuel or not enough fuel.

So to answer your questions yes they all are used to control fuel flow but how itís controlled is whatís important


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